Anatech Electronics (RF Filters) - RF Cafe
Exodus Advanced Communications Best in Class RF Amplifier SSPAs
 

About RF Cafe

Kirt Blattenberger - RF Cafe Webmaster

Copyright: 1996 - 2024
Webmaster:
    Kirt Blattenberger,

    BSEE - KB3UON

RF Cafe began life in 1996 as "RF Tools" in an AOL screen name web space totaling 2 MB. Its primary purpose was to provide me with ready access to commonly needed formulas and reference material while performing my work as an RF system and circuit design engineer. The World Wide Web (Internet) was largely an unknown entity at the time and bandwidth was a scarce commodity. Dial-up modems blazed along at 14.4 kbps while tying up your telephone line, and a nice lady's voice announced "You've Got Mail" when a new message arrived...

All trademarks, copyrights, patents, and other rights of ownership to images and text used on the RF Cafe website are hereby acknowledged.

My Hobby Website:

AirplanesAndRockets.com

Electronics World articles Popular Electronics articles QST articles Radio & TV News articles Radio-Craft articles Radio-Electronics articles Short Wave Craft articles Wireless World articles Google Search of RF Cafe website Sitemap Electronics Equations Mathematics Equations Equations physics Manufacturers & distributors Engineer Jobs LinkedIn Crosswords Engineering Humor Kirt's Cogitations RF Engineering Quizzes Notable Quotes App Notes Calculators Education Engineering magazine articles Engineering software Engineering smorgasbord RF Cafe Archives RF Cascade Workbook 2018 RF Symbols for Visio - Word Advertising RF Cafe Homepage Thank you for visiting RF Cafe!
Innovative Power Products Couplers

tail current mirror - RF Cafe Forums

RF Cafe Forums closed its virtual doors in 2012 mainly due to other social media platforms dominating public commenting venues. RF Cafe Forums began sometime around August of 2003 and was quite well-attended for many years. By 2010, Facebook and Twitter were overwhelmingly dominating online personal interaction, and RF Cafe Forums activity dropped off precipitously. If the folks at phpBB would release a version with integrated sign-in from the major social media platforms, I would resurrect the RF Cafe Forums, but until then it is probably not worth the effort. Regardless, there are still lots of great posts in the archive that ware worth looking at.

Below are the old forum threads, including responses to the original posts.

-- Amateur Radio
-- Anecdotes, Gripes & Humor
-- Antennas
-- CAE, CAD, & Software
-- Circuits & Components
-- Employment & Interviews
-- Miscellany
-- Swap Shop
-- Systems
-- Test & Measurement
-- Webmaster

guest
Post subject: tail current mirror Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:02 pm
hi
in IC's usually differential pairs are biased using current mirror (to set current in the emitters of the differential pair transistors).i'm reading in the book but i don't see how the ac voltage wont' see the current mirror?my understanding is that ac will also go through the current mirror and thus voltage across the differentail pair will be reduced.i don't see any ac chokes, etc between current mirror and differential pair.


Top

Guest
Post subject: Current MirrorPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 3:14 am
The output impedance of the current mirror is very high, though it does decrease with frequency (the exact behavior is device specific). That means it acts like an RF choke.

The underlying issue you seem to have is distinguishing between voltage and current. The voltage at the junction of the two emitters and the collector of the current mirror does in fact go up and down with the base voltages of the diff-pair. The current through the current source (= current mirror) does not change, because it's determined (primarily) by beta times the base current - which is not connected to a signal point. So "AC goes through the current mirror" is not correct - the current stays essentially constant. But there IS an AC voltage at the junction. (English can be such a confusing language - "AC voltage" really has nothing to do with Current, but we say it anyway!)

Good Luck!


Top

guest
Post subject: Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 6:17 am
thanks...makes sense; appreciate it


Top

guest
Post subject: Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 1:24 am
i said it makes sense but i gain started looking at it and i again have this question: if as you said if current mirror acts like a RF/ac choke then the emitter of my actual transistor needs to be grounded in AC operation....if my current mirror is a choke then my emitter is floating...please reply thanks


Top

guest
Post subject: Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 2:49 am
i just asked the question again....in answering assume that i'm biasing a single transistor and not a differential pair....the way i'm understanding is that if you bias a single transistor then you will have to provide a dc block at the emitter to ground if you want your ac signal to couple to ground at the emitter.....however, if you use differential pair then because of what is known as ac virtual ground at the two emitter connection then you don't need a coupling cap for your ac to couple to ground

is my understanding correct please tell me or explain what is the right way.


Top

Guest
Post subject: Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 11:34 am
Hi

You're right. For some reason if you want to bias a single transistor with a current mirror in its emitter then you would need a coupling cap. from emitter to ground if your emitter is supposed to be at ac ground.

But in case of differential pair you don't need a coupling cap. at the connected emitters. You can think of it two ways. In small signal ac, there is a virtual ground at the emitter node. Also, you can look at it from impedance point of view, as earlier post suggested. The impedance looking into the current mirror is quite high, Ro = early voltage/IC and so the current instead of going to the current mirror instead goes to the "other side" (transistor)---meaning no current goes to current mirror.

However, as I said, if you're using just a single transistor biased with a current mirro then you need a coupling cap because there is no virtual ground or for current to any where else.

Hope this helps.




Posted  11/12/2012
RF Cascade Workbook 2018 - RF Cafe
Werbel Microwave - RF Cafe
Axiom Test Equipment - RF Cafe
 

Please Support RF Cafe by purchasing my  ridiculously low−priced products, all of which I created.

These Are Available for Free